TOPIC:

MDgal wrote:

Thanks a lot Selva. I am hopeful. What are manual counts? I'm guessing mine are automated

Skip the question on the other page! Woo hoo! Moving on up. Yup, the hardest part is definitely the waiting. Especially because you can't "see" what's going on inside your body.

patti

Manual count is when they physically count by seeing thru microscope.
You can read more here.
blood.ygoy.com/complete-blood-count-complete-blood-count-test-automated-and-manual-test/
This is important because ITP people have more newer platelets which are bigger in size and sometimes not counted by the machine, also platelets tend to clump together, such platelets are also not counted by machine. So when they do manual count, you get higher numbers.

patti wrote:

I enjoy Mercola's stuff as well. However, having done both naturopathy for 6+ years (which is what he would be classified as even though he's an MD) and homeopathy for the past 7 months, I can say hands down that homeopathy is FAR more effective. It deals at the core, works much faster, and the healing "sticks." Naturopathy is not that way.

patti

Patti,
You seem to have gained a lot of knowledge from your years of naturopathy and I have many times appreciated you sharing it on this forum.
I don't understand what you mean by the core.???

sally wrote:

patti wrote:

I enjoy Mercola's stuff as well. However, having done both naturopathy for 6+ years (which is what he would be classified as even though he's an MD) and homeopathy for the past 7 months, I can say hands down that homeopathy is FAR more effective. It deals at the core, works much faster, and the healing "sticks." Naturopathy is not that way.

patti

Patti,
You seem to have gained a lot of knowledge from your years of naturopathy and I have many times appreciated you sharing it on this forum.
I don't understand what you mean by the core.???

For me, the core is the gut. 80% of the immune system lies in the gut. Heal the gut, and you heal the immune system. The million dollar question becomes, "how do you do that?" Not sure what the best way to explain this is. Naturopathy tends to supplement the body with what tests might show someone is low in and then add those things into the body via supplements, diet, etc. in an attempt to get the body to right itself. Removing environmental allergens, food allergens, chemical usage (cleaners, etc.) would all fall under this category. These are attempts to put the body in the best possible position to heal itself. In and of themselves, most supplements will not heal.

Homeopathy deals at an electrical level (cellular level would be another good name for it). We're all made of protons, neutrons and electrons and we all have an electrical balance in our bodies. If your electrical system gets screwed up pertaining to your heart, you might have a heart attack. Homeopathy aims to right the energy system of the body and put it back in balance. When that happens, the body goes into action healing itself. The remedies don't do the healing. They put the body in a place to heal itself. The same thing that naturopathy attempts to do, but from a different perspective and method.

For the two years prior to my boy's ITP we were using diet, supplements, etc. to try and right his immune system and fix his gut (we'd been using natur. prior to that on other family members). We had known for years his immune system was messed up and kept trying to fix it with diet, juicing, etc. Those things helped to sort of keep us status quo until his immune system boiled over into the ITP. After using the homeopathy for his ITP, all of the things we kept trying to fix with diet, are getting fixed finally. His gut has undergone HUGE healing. Luke had 40+ food allergies that he developed starting at age 14 mos. It was to the point where I had to carry an epi pen because one day he'd be able to eat a food and the next day he'd have a near anaphylactic reaction to that same food. His list of what he could eat was shorter then his list of what he couldn't eat. And then the platelets hit zero. We could have given him every drug under the sun and it wouldn't have fixed his ITP. The two we did try only caused more damage to his gut and body. His whole electrical (energy) system was completely out of whack. Once we dealt with that, his whole body started healing. We now have normal platelets and one last food allergy that we're working on. All of that in less then 7 months when we had spent 2 plus years and $15,000+ naturapathically, working on him.

I think what I learned from the naturapathy was how to eat good, whole foods, what vits. and minerals we were lacking that either had to be made up for with diet or supplements, etc. So there was merit to learning all of that. But in the long run, I do not believe it will bring healing right at the core of the body (the gut) where most of our immune system lies. At least not without maintaining that strict regimine of diet, etc. I have friends who have had aplastic anemia (bone marrow failure) of all three cell lines and managed to heal it completely using juicing and foods. It CAN be done. But in my mind, time is of the essence and money isn't endless (it took them 2+ years to heal that way). Homeopathy addressed both those issues for us and I use it almost exclusively for my family now (although I admit to still liking to use my garlic and oil of oregano!). I do not believe one has to be exclusive of the other and I don't get the impression that is the case for good homeopaths either. One would likely find they eat healthy, don't use a lot of chemicals, etc. even though they may treat disease or illness homeopathically.

Not sure if that helps much. Wordy. But sometimes it's hard to put h-pathy into understandable language (at least for me it is!). Especially in comparison to naturopathy. When it comes to gut healing (which MUST take place if you're going to heal the immune system), I know no better way then the h-pathy.

patti


p.s. and we need a spell checker.

Thanks for the reply Patti.
I am very happy homeopathy is working for your son and pray that it continues.
It still sounds a bit mystical for me. I am open to mysticism and enjoy my naturopath doing neurolink (muscle testing) which is also a bit mystical. I wouldn't have paid for the neurolink though, except that it came in a package with advice on diet and herbs. I guess accupuncture is also a bit mystical but has gained such wide acceptance, mainly because of it's effectiveness with treating pain. I tried it for muscle pain, again in a package with massage, and found it amazing (I'm really just engaging in some self talk here, just sending it out to the www. - hope I don't waste too much of other people's valuable time). I guess I'm sort of talking myself into at least giving homeopathy a go at some time. At the moment however I'm still enjoying exploring different herbs.

Sally,

Sorry I'm just now getting back to this. Busy few days.

As a born again christian we are VERY careful of anything that is "mystical." My husband and I did a lot of research before we decided homeopathy was a safe route for our son from a spiritual perspective (as well as medical). This is an excellent article that just barely touches the surface of how homeopathy works from a physics standpoint. www.huffingtonpost.com/dana-ullman/luc-montagnier-homeopathy-taken-seriously_b_814619.html?ref=fb&src=sp

Water has very unique electrical abilities (read: energy abilities) and that is how homeopathy is made. If you're at all interested in physics it's an interesting study. Definitely not mystical at all once you dive into it. I think you're correct when you say people didn't accept other natural healing methods for a long time either. Although, homeopathy has been around for a VERY long time (long before Samuel H. came around they were using it in India). I know for us, it was mostly a lack of knowledge of the physics involved and not really searching it out until we desperately needed it.

I really liked acupuncture when I used it. I thought it was quite effective for pain control. Didn't work so well for my MIL with her platelets. But it helped her in other areas as it prolonged her life quite a bit.

I have so many dried herbs in cold storage. I rarely use them anymore (once in awhile I do) because I find the homeopathy so much faster, cheaper and easier. It was much easier for me to take homeopathic comfrey in the form of symphytum when I broke my leg and ankle last summer then it would have been to make a poultice and smear it all over them and leave them for a few hours 4x's a day. Can you say, "messy?!" yikes.


patti

Sally,

You probably already have a good source of herbs, but thought I'd share this one. www.bulkherbstore.com is a fantastic place to get stuff from. I love their website and catalog. Full of good info.

patti

Thanks again Patti,
I'll keep it in mind.
Have sent the link on the homeopathic article to my mildly asbergist (?spelling) partner who is currently working away (engineering , of course! ).
I have often said that we Itpers are a sensitive mob. I'm staring to think that this could be our strength if we develop out sensitivities and use them wisely.
I am cautiously starting on a new combination of herbs but haven't let go of the old ones. I find that I really crave the codonopsis/ astragalis combo some mornings, about the time when i used to want a cup of coffee. Codonopsis is an adrenal stimulant for me (I am pretty certain) without the the resulting energy drop I would get with coffee. Codonopsis is thought of as ginseng's baby sister - I can't take ginseng as it increases my BP.
There's something incredible in these herbs and I think a lot of people are frightened of them - for good reasons . I like the liquid herbs because you can taste the herb and get a stronger connection with them, but they are much stronger than the dried herbs so I keep the dose low when feeling unsure.
Sorry. I shouldn't really be rambling on about this on the homeopathy thread, but I feel a bit on my own with these herbs. I can understand not using herbs with children, and homeopathy being a great option for them. I also understand why people who are being treated with medical drugs and their platelet levels are very unstable might find taking herbs unnecessary, too complicating or frightening, But I would like to see people whose platelets are stable trying a few more natural remedies - I think it could benefit them and our understanding of Itp.
Thanks for listening to my early morning ramblings .

How have you been since you wrote this?

We have been seeing a nutrionist who is treating my daughters "gut" with supplements, cleanses, etc--is this the same as homopathy? Where would I get information on the difference?

nancyknuth wrote:

We have been seeing a nutrionist who is treating my daughters "gut" with supplements, cleanses, etc--is this the same as homopathy? Where would I get information on the difference?

The way your daughter is being treated is considered naturopathy. Homeopathy is a different method and does not use supplements, etc. We spent many years trying to heal our boy's immune system (he had issues with it prior to ITP) with naturopathy. It wasn't until we did the homeopathy that we actually got healing. From our personal experience with naturopathy, homeopathy, chinese medicine, acupuncture, etc., hands down, homeopathy is the ONLY thing that brought actual, true healing. The other methods brought about great support to the body and helped strengthen in while in a sickened state. But they never brought us true healing.

HTH

patti

nancyknuth wrote:

How have you been since you wrote this?

Things are still moving slow. Since I wrote this I have gotten off steroids and it has taken me about 3 months to almost get rid of most of the side effects from the prednisone, still trying to lose some of the weight. My platelets are still low. I last checked two weeks ago and it was at 18K and I had been at that level for about 3 weeks prior. Since then I have taken my homeopathic remedy again and will get counts done this week again.

My petechaie symptoms have improved, I barely get to see them anymore but I do bruise on my legs every now and then. I always have dull headaches at counts under 35 and I have been here for a while so the headaches and tiredness are no fun but when my counts go up, those should go away. I am hoping I can see some results before June when I see my hem again and we start talking splenectomy. This is really really hard a disaease to deal with but God will see me through

This is really really hard a disaease to deal with but God will see me through

Amen.

MDgal, One of the hardest parts of h-pathy is the waiting. You had the added issue of having to come off the pred. and then get rid of it's side effects first. I think you'll start seeing a rise pretty quick now that you're past that point. Prednisone can be worked through with h-pathy, but with great difficulty and MUCH slower results. So coming off of it and holding at 18K and not dropping is good. I expect you'll start seeing climbs. keep us posted!

Patti, I am going to a homeopathic Dr next week. I am believing she will help me and I just know that it will heal my entire body....Is your child still healed? I just know this is right for me. Some I know it will not work for but I am trusting GOd on this one. He is my real DR>
Shannon

patti wrote:

MDgal, One of the hardest parts of h-pathy is the waiting. You had the added issue of having to come off the pred. and then get rid of it's side effects first. I think you'll start seeing a rise pretty quick now that you're past that point. Prednisone can be worked through with h-pathy, but with great difficulty and MUCH slower results. So coming off of it and holding at 18K and not dropping is good. I expect you'll start seeing climbs. keep us posted!

Thanks Patti. You're right, the hardest part is the waiting but I do see my body healing. The skin issues from the prednisone are almost gone, as well as the achy joints. My platelet count is 23....Yaay!!! This is slow but my body is going through some deep healing. Homeopathy is great. I cringe these days at the thought of taking western medicine.....prednisone was not kind to me. Anyway, hope you had a great Easter holiday!!!!

iam4ual wrote:

Patti, I am going to a homeopathic Dr next week. I am believing she will help me and I just know that it will heal my entire body....Is your child still healed? I just know this is right for me. Some I know it will not work for but I am trusting GOd on this one. He is my real DR>
Shannon

Go for it. It may be slow but you will be amazed at how many other issues will be healed alongside the ITP. Any yes oh yes, the ultimate healer is GOD. GOD can heal you through any means, so follow your gut feelings, pray & all will be well.

MDGAL

Thank you so much for the words of encouragement. I really have been through the ringer with my hema. He has not explained ANYTHING to me. What I have learned about ITP has been on here and other webpages. My counts were at 98000 on Friday from 11000 after a pulse of Dex..and he wanted me to begin them again that day. I told him I wanted to wait 2 weeks and he got huffy with me and did not want to even check my count before I start the meds again. You would think he would want to know if they had some up any more/ Oh well, I just know this is going to help me mentally and physically to do homepathic.

SHannon

Shannon, you may want to consider seeing another Hema. With counts of 98,000 most Doctors don't treat. I've been bouncing around between 18 and 33 and my hema is just monitoring my counts without treatment. Treat only when you have to but know your symptoms very well. I am lucky I am not a bleeder so even though the low platelets suck, I am able to give the homeopathy time to work on my body. However, I get my counts done ever so often to monitor my progress. Don't over medicate yourself if you don't have to.

MDgal,
I agree with you that I do not want to over medicate. But it appears that the give the pulses even with decent counts in order to get a remission. I am going to get me another Hema. because this one just does not explain anything. I cannot wait to get to the homeopathic dr I really think this will help. My dr just wants to take out my spleen. But the cure rate with that is just not that good. I do not want my spleen out and still have ITP. He says that people with their spleen out rarely have to have treatment.I have found for the most part this is not true. I want to keep my spleen. I am just believing that God made my body to heal itself and sometimes it needs help. I just know the homeopathic way along with a GOOD hema will help me.
Shannon

Shannon -
You are on the right track. You should always be the #1 advocate for your health. ITP is just not typical so most Dr's end up following the therapies listed in the medical books drug for drug and you end up being just a test tube with chemicals poured in with the hope of a positive reaction. It is very important to do your own research, so you can pick your Doctor's brain and weigh all your options and always discuss SIDE EFFECTS at length. Doctor's brush over them like they don't exist but they do. This site helped me with a lot of questions I had initially, then I also have quite a few number of Doctor friends so I picked their brains too.

Initally I was treated at one of the best hospitals when it comes to blood issues but not much luck. After 6 months, I realized they also didn't know how to deal with this and I was now just a test with everyone guessing at what could make it better. I did the prednisone which got me sick, the IVIG lasted only about a week each time, the Rituxan just didn't work, they offered me Imuran (this drug has lymphoma listed as a side effect....) and I said NO!!!! I then got a new Hemo who picked the next thing out of the bunch, I took the Winrho and got so sick and I pulled the plug on all the treatments after that and told my Hemo to get me off the prednisone...the tappering took about 6 months. I Started taking my vitamins, just the vitamins alone made my symptoms get better, so those drugs must have robbed some things from me.

After that, I started homeopathy and was able to get off the prednisone. I've been off prednisone for 4 months now and still on my journey to save my spleen:) . With ITP I think our immune system gets the wrong memo and starts creating antibodies against our platelets. I strongly believe homeopathy can correct that. Unfortunately with as much prednisone as I took for a year, my immune system is responding very slowly but it is responding positively.

MDgal wrote:

Initally I was treated at one of the best hospitals when it comes to blood issues but not much luck. After 6 months, I realized they also didn't know how to deal with this and I was now just a test with everyone guessing at what could make it better.

I think they do know how to deal with it, but many times the outcome is not the result that the patient expects to see.

My Dr I think is knowledgeable for the most part just does not see much of it and does not communicate very well at all. I have to guess what he is thinking. Like when he told me he wanted me to go on and start another round of meds he did not say that ones treated every two weeks have a high rate of remission. If he had just told me that I would not have said not (maybe) but he does not communicate the whys of things so therefore I do not know what is going on half the time.

IF he would just tell me things I would feel better.

I just want to add the homeopathic to this knowing that natural is ALWAYS better. I feel that if I can use more natural than not then the better off I am. I will still go to my dr or maybe another hema but will still go to one.

Shannon

Shannon:

Two points to ponder:

1. Your doctor may not realize that you don't understand or that you have questions. Some doctors do not know that communication is important to some patients...they might just be used to doling out the orders with mostly compliant people. Please don't take this the wrong way, but do you ask questions? I know it can be hard when you feel rushed through, but it's okay to say "Wait - stop for a second. Why do you....?"

2. I have always been confused by what the word 'natural' really means. For example, I just ordered some Quercetin w/Bromelain because I read that it's a great anti-inflammatory and anti-histamine. However, just because those are 'natural' substances does not mean that there is no risk. I don't know a thing about the company that manufactures them. Could there have been any contamination of the product? There could be E coli, mercury, or rat feces in there. It's possible that the capsules are filled with ground pasta, I'd never know the difference. It's also possible that it could have something in it that could exacerbate one of my problems or affect the absorption of one of my medications. Point is...just because it says natural on the bottle or someone says it is does not make it harmless.

Grapefruit juice is natural too but when mixed with some medications, it can be lethal.

Sandi,
Actually, me and my husband ask questions. He just has not been very good at answering our questions. My DR tends to just tell you what he wants and NEVER gives any hope or ideas for anything. Infact when I asked him about WhinRho he knew nothing about it and said he had NEVER in 25 yrs ever used it. He does not see the need for any type of treatment except steroids and splenectomy. He even had a patient call me to try to get me to have a spenectomy. I have been seeing him for 3 months and he has yet to explain anything even when I question him. He said I think you have Lupus because I had a positive ANA. I have Hashimotos and it will cause a positive ANA. I was DX 18 yrs ago with Rheumetoid arthritis after 8 yrs it just went away. I cannot explain it other than GOD. But I was tested and treated for it and I now have no signs of it and now all my tests for it are negative. He said that I never had it 18 yrs ago I had Lupus. Now Sandi do you not think that if I had had Lupus for the last 18yr of my life that I would know it. Besides all my bloodwork and xrays then said I had RA. I just am not sure he truly knows enough about ITP. It really is not his specialty.

As far as "natural" means of treatment, I just feel it is always better to use something that comes from as close to natural as you can get. Not that they cannot or do not at times come with side effects too, but think about it, my husbands grandmother lived to be 100 and up until she was 95 she lived on her own. She never took gobs of medication she took what she had to have and ate healthy and stayed active. Back years ago they had to rely on natural means of treatments and old home remedies and they worked, and that is all they had. I am very glad modern medicine had come so far to be able to save more lives but sometimes I think Drs are too quick to throw drugs at people and treat by the book instead of by symptoms and how a person feels. Not everyone is by the book...ITP proves that. Everyone is different. I have thought and researched a lot about homeopathic Drs and I know it will not work for everyone and I know I will still have to use a hematologist too. I just want to keep my body as healthy as I can and possibly do this without steroids. If natural means will keep my platelets in a safe range I will be thrilled. I am trusting God to lead me and I am letting, as the Bible says,the Peace of God be my guide. I am using wisdom in my decisions and will not ever do anything to put my life in danger.

Oh and I forgot to mention I have not hurt in my joints from RA in over 10 years. And I have not one symptom of Lupus even my regular dr said that I do not have Lupus and he has seen me for years. He also said that none of my bloodwork points to Lupus.

I guess I am rambling now, sorry!
Thanks for giving me something to think about, but I am ahead of you there. FOr the past 3 months all I have been doing to researching and asking questions. I feel like I really do not have anything to lose to try a homeopathic dr. If it works I have gained much!
Shannon

Shannon:

The things you are saying about your doctor are red flags to me. "Only Prednisone and splenectomy", never used Win-Rho, asked a patient to call you." That, in addition to his lack of ability to work with you, would cause me to switch doctors. I believe that you are asking questions and researching.

You're right, a positive ANA does not mean Lupus. You cannot be diagnosed with Lupus without symptoms (which you don't seem to have) and labs that support the diagnosis. I'd pooh-pooh that statement by him and chalk it up to what - ignorance?

As for your RA, it's possible that it went into remission. It happens with autoimmune disorders all the time (not as often as we'd all like though). I think that's great!

Now for the natural topic: Back in the day, products were purer than they are now because they really were home made or they were not tainted by all of the toxins that are around these days. You can't even get a salad at a restaurant without the possibility of E coli contamination. I don't trust that anything is 100% 'pure', especially products that are promoted by web sites as a natural way to treat a disorder. You're right, drugs are not necessarily better and they can cause damage, but at least you know the risks up front.

Look at soy - promoted as natural and healthy, but most likely caused my daughter to be diagnosed with Graves Disease. When she was a baby, she had an intolerance to formula. She had projectile vomiting and we tried every formula there was. Her doctor suggested Prosobee which is soy based. She was on it for about 6 months. Fast forward 21 years and she is diagnosed with Graves. I am finding article after article that state that babies who drank soy based formulas were more likely to develop thyroid disorders. Just type "soy" and "thyroid" into a search engine and you'll get 1,000 hits. I don't know that soy caused her Graves for sure, but it could have been a contributing factor. My other two children did not use soy based formula and they do not have thyroid problems.

Alfalfa - exacerbates Lupus.

I hope you have success with your choices, I really do. Just be aware that 'natural' does always not mean 'safe'.

Sandi,
I am switching Drs here within the next week or so. I agree with you.

I would think that my RA was in remission too except I got bloodwork done for it a month ago and it all came back negative so for what ever reason it is gone Praise the LORD!

As far as the natural goes I am checking things out and I will not take anything that I do not research first. I am that way about everything. But thank you for the warning.

I guess I am just crazy but I used to be an accountant before deciding to be a stay home mom. So I do facts and research alot, my hubby says I should have been an Engineer

Shannon

Research is also my forte'. I am in the legal field, opposite of medical, but I search medical more because of our assorted health problems. You're not crazy - you're wise!

Negative blood work can occur during remissions. Antibodies come and go. My Lupus labs have been good too for about 3 years, but I still have symptoms so it's not in remission.

Sandi wrote:

Shannon:


Look at soy - promoted as natural and healthy, but most likely caused my daughter to be diagnosed with Graves Disease. other two children did not use soy based formula and they do not have thyroid problems.
.

Oh snapps , I had switched to soy milk for the past 5 months, (ocassionally I have used whole cow milk in powder form these past 5 months). I went from regular milk, to rice milk and now soy milk. Okay, going for Almond Milk next. Thanks for sharing Sandi. I didn't realize Soy milk had sooo much controversy

Ha - doesn't everything have controversy? Yes, I am not a big fan of soy. Too many bad things about it.